As the Pa. state school system chancellor prepares to leave, PASSHE records the smallest enrollment decline in more than a decade

The Pennsylvania State System of Higher Education has a bit of bright news as Daniel Greenstein concludes his six-year tenure as its chancellor next week.

Enrollment, which has been declining significantly for more than a decade, is just about flat this year.

“I’d like to say the ship is turned,” Greenstein said Friday of the system’s 82,509-student enrollment. “We’re down 179 [0.2%]. To me, that’s flat … I could bring out friends of mine, get them to enroll in a … course at one of our universities, and we would be there. I’m claiming victory.”

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Last year, enrollment fell 2.2%. In 2022, it dropped about 5%, and in 2021, 5.4%. Since 2010, when enrollment was nearly 120,000, the system has lost more than 30% of its students.

Greenstein, who on Nov. 1 will join the higher education practice of Baker Tilly’s Philadelphia office — an international accounting and advisory firm — discussed PASSHE enrollment and other highlights from his tenure in recent interviews.

The interviews have been edited for length and clarity.

The tuition freeze. [For six consecutive years, the system froze tuition at $7,716, the same as it was the year Greenstein became chancellor.] Student affordability is important. It makes us accessible and drives so many other things.

If you gave me two things, I would say the partnership with the state. The dialogue around PASSHE has changed in six years. It did not attract a great deal of trust [when he started]. … There were questions about its management, its effectiveness and its transparency. That whole dialogue has changed.

[Legislators] don’t necessarily agree with each other or with me, but that’s not the point. They understand the roles that higher education plays is important to the state … We saw this last year with the engagement on the governor’s blueprint [for higher education] … they are engaging in a meaningful way in problem-solving. That’s huge. Not true in every state, and that’s a gift.

I’m proud to be part of that. I don’t think I created it.

If you take yourself out of it, and you take the ego out of it, and you’re there to problem-solve, you listen to people actively and you try to hear what they are saying, try to search for the solutions that they care about, it’s not an issue.

It’s a battleship. Turning around a battleship is hard. The tuition [freezes] have helped. The improved tone of the conversation around PASSHE has been helpful. The fact that we are getting our message out more effectively about our value and workforce alignment.

» READ MORE: Half of Pennsylvania’s state universities saw enrollment rise this fall

I’m super excited. This is a terrible year [given ongoing problems with federal student financial aid forms]. So to be flat is pretty good. We were down in first-time [students], I think 4% or 5%, but we were up considerably in graduate [students], transfers … The first-time students are the ones most impacted by the FAFSA debacle. I’m so proud. I know it’s the right time to leave now.

There’s almost nothing we can’t do if we put our minds to it.

Yes, 100%. Hard, but the right thing to do. The students at the smaller schools have access to 80-plus degrees, majors, minors, programs. That would have been gone. I’m not even factoring in what would our relationship with the state have been like if we had not aggressively gotten our arms around our management issues, our financial issues.

Our colleagues in the legislature were very clear: We want to invest in higher education. Give us the confidence that we can. And we did, and they did. God bless them.

I can’t predict. Higher education [generally]? 100%.

Coordination can be great. I can point to states where it’s very effective … PASSHE’s relations with the community colleges have never been better, and that’s probably a product of the governor’s initiative. We’re working very closely together. So there’s opportunity for that kind of thing going forward, huge in my view.

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Look, there’s never enough to do all the things I want to do because I would have done both. But I think it’s a major step … in the right direction. Obviously, we have more to do for students with real need. And I don’t think that discussion is closed off by any means.

Obviously, it’s a different administration, but he is very, very invested, put it that way, in higher education and workforce. So, in some ways, there’s a lot of continuity there in terms of the approach.

He obviously wants to get stuff done. He says that and it’s demonstrated in the work he does.

To me, it’s all about the mission, the impact. It’s never been about the money or the business model or the tax status. It’s where is there a chance to really lean in and help? The challenges are so great.

If we had this conversation six years go, I would say the challenges had to do with the business model and access and completion. That’s all still true. Now, you’ve got layered on top of that the massive technology disruptions [with artificial intelligence]. You’ve got this decline in public trust, which is a huge problem. You’ve got these political issues that are not going away any time soon.

And you’ve got this real important conversation about value: What is the value of higher education?

Helping them build the practice. The reason to go there is to be able to work with institutions that are confronting all these problems. It’s a higher leverage use of my time.

I think there’s probably some legal language that puts some constraint on that. I may not be allowed to come back for a little while. Whatever the constraints are, we’ll follow them.

I will. We have that little rowhouse and people hang out on the porches, on the street. We feel welcome there, love the city.